.comment-link {margin-left:.6em;}

The Hazzn's Tish

Or: A Cantorial Student's Dispatches from his Outpost in Manhattan

Thursday, February 03, 2005

Egalitarianism (Postscript)

The public has spoken: it is offensive to distinguish between kohanim and b'not kohen. As of this coming Monday, a person of priestly lineage honored with the first `aliyyah will be called simply by "ya`amod / ta`amod [name]." "Kohen q'rav" and "bat kohen qirvi" are to be disused.

Sigh.

8 Comments:

Blogger Integrator said...

So then is the big kahuna a male or a female? =P

Seriously, have these people just given up on the existence of a third Temple in the name of "equality" that cannot exist anyway?

*sigh* is right!

The Vortex

Thursday, February 03, 2005 2:22:00 PM  
Blogger fleurdelis28 said...

Hawaian kohanim...now THAT's an idea.

Thursday, February 03, 2005 2:49:00 PM  
Blogger Lawrence said...

Vortex:

We are allowed to identify the father of the `oleh as a kohen. The only issue is refering to the `oleh as a kohen or bat kohen — why aren't men called b'nei kohen? (And yes, I know the answer to that.)

In any case, I've met few people of this general school of thought with an interest in building a third Temple in the first place. (I don't know who brought the complaint, so I know nothing about the personal political inclinations of the party in question.)

Thursday, February 03, 2005 3:02:00 PM  
Blogger Maya Resnikoff said...

I suppose that communities could decide to only give the first aliyah to matched-pairs of kohanim, and therefore always call them up as "ya'amdu... b'nei kohanim"- unless they were siblings, in which case would it be "b'nei kohain"?

Err, perhaps it's time to institute some other, more acceptable word form? Kohenet, I guess?

Friday, February 04, 2005 12:25:00 AM  
Blogger Lawrence said...

Naomi: The issue is not so much the gender distinction — which is easy, as my extensive research has revealed the gender, if not actually the sex, of each person at the yeshiva — but the distinction between a kohen (being fully a priest) and a bat kohen (being a priest's daughter, and therefore something else, which is totally unfair).

The solution we're currently following is the rosh yeshiva's suggestion, which I have to admit is effective insofar as it does not say anything technically inaccurate. (I have heard, in other places, arguments for use of the term "kohenet," which is not a Jewish status that exists outside of Dan Brown's mind.)

And yes, Hebrew does present an interesting obstacle. Makes me wonder to what extent this sort of gender sensitivity exists here in Israel. (The only outward manifestation I've noticed is for some people to use the term ish for "husband," rather than ba`al. Even this is not used widely, though I happen to think it's perfectly reasonable.)

Debka: If group `aliyyot worked, maybe. I am of the school of thought that says they don't. In any case, we would be required to say "ya`amdu" and "ta`amodna" on alternating qeri'ot hatorah in order to be completely fair.

As for kohenet, see above. I tend to draw the line on political correctness when it starts to re-write languages in ways that make no sense.

Friday, February 04, 2005 5:13:00 AM  
Blogger Maya Resnikoff said...

I did read part of a book by Bernadette Brooten as part of some research for a paper last semester that mentions that there are a few gravestones that do record a woman's status as something along the lines of kohenet- not with any implication that her roles was different because of that, but as a status/geneological marker. The reference is: Bernadette J. Brooten, Women Leaders in the Ancient Synagogue: Inscriptional Evidence and Background Issues. Scholars Press, Chico, CA, 1982. So maybe there's So evidence- although as I remember it, that was just slightly post destruction of the Temple, and in somewhere mildly weird. But still...

On a side note: There does seem to be more evidence that leviot were accepted into the musical duties of levites at least on occasion, if not their other duties. So- would that mean that there's more textual background to allow bnot levi to get the second aliyah than for bnot kohen to get the first, if one is working things that way?

Friday, February 04, 2005 11:40:00 AM  
Blogger Lawrence said...

R' Roth's decision allowing b'not Kohen and L'viyyot to take the Kohen and Levi `aliyyot is, as I understand it, based entirely upon recognition of ancestry, and not upon roles in the Temple.

Sunday, February 06, 2005 5:37:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Actually, the word kohenet appears 10 times in the Mishna and 9 times in the Tosefta. (Thanks Bar-Ilan!) It some cases it refers a woman, regardless of her tribal affiliation, who is the wife of a kohen (e.g., Yevamot 11:5; Ketubot 4:8, 7:1,2) and sometimes it refers to a woman who is a bat kohen herself (e.g., Sotah 3:7; Kiddushin 3:5,12; Tosefta Sotah 2:6, 5:4; Tosefta Kiddushin 4:15, 5:2). So it seems like there's at least precedent for calling a bat kohen a kohenet.

Thanks for reminding me why I left the CY and the Conservative movement, which is not to say that the Orthodox side of the fence doesn't have its own share of silliness (to pick a mild word).

(Yes, you guys know me somewhat well -- say hi to Terri for me, and I'm really sorry I never got in touch after your wedding.)

Sunday, February 13, 2005 12:43:00 AM  

Post a Comment

<< Home